Comments on: The basic problem of today’s rail debate http://ilind.net/2010/03/05/the-basic-problem-of-todays-rail-debate/ Ian Lind • Online daily from Kaaawa, Hawaii Mon, 13 Feb 2012 23:47:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Zweisystem http://ilind.net/2010/03/05/the-basic-problem-of-todays-rail-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-15978 Zweisystem Sat, 06 Mar 2010 20:52:56 +0000 http://ilind.net/?p=4422#comment-15978 I am not saying this will happen in Hawaii, but when builds an expensive metro system (the Belgians call LRT Pre-Metro) and there isn't the funds to finish the job or enough ridership to warrant operation, the metro is mothballed. This is what happened in Charleroi, Belgium, a grand Pre-Metro plan that ran out of funds and passengers. http://railforthevalley.wordpress.com/2009/01/26/the-charleroi-pre-metro-the-metro-that-was-built-and-they-didnt-come-a-short-history-on-failed-transit-planning/ When one is spending a couple of billion dollars on a transit system, one wants to get the best 'bang' for their buck. The political embarrassment is when there is little or no bang for the money invested, like Seattle. LRT is not a panacea, but a proven method to provide an affordable, high capacity transit system to an urban centre. The question of being elevated or not, is one of emotion, not good transit planning. The worst thing is planning transit for all the wrong reasons, like Ottawa Canada, which opted for BRT instead of light rail. It was found that BRT cost more to build and that when built, ridership dropped about 15% on the busway system over a period of 10 years. Ottawa is now planning for LRT once again. I am not saying this will happen in Hawaii, but when builds an expensive metro system (the Belgians call LRT Pre-Metro) and there isn’t the funds to finish the job or enough ridership to warrant operation, the metro is mothballed.

This is what happened in Charleroi, Belgium, a grand Pre-Metro plan that ran out of funds and passengers.

http://railforthevalley.wordpress.com/2009/01/26/the-charleroi-pre-metro-the-metro-that-was-built-and-they-didnt-come-a-short-history-on-failed-transit-planning/

When one is spending a couple of billion dollars on a transit system, one wants to get the best ‘bang’ for their buck. The political embarrassment is when there is little or no bang for the money invested, like Seattle.

LRT is not a panacea, but a proven method to provide an affordable, high capacity transit system to an urban centre. The question of being elevated or not, is one of emotion, not good transit planning.

The worst thing is planning transit for all the wrong reasons, like Ottawa Canada, which opted for BRT instead of light rail. It was found that BRT cost more to build and that when built, ridership dropped about 15% on the busway system over a period of 10 years.

Ottawa is now planning for LRT once again.

]]> By: chuck smith http://ilind.net/2010/03/05/the-basic-problem-of-todays-rail-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-15964 chuck smith Sat, 06 Mar 2010 18:41:13 +0000 http://ilind.net/?p=4422#comment-15964 Ian, you summarized it very neatly. The "review of available options" was in essence a simulacrum of an actual review, a facsimile of a real review designed to manage perceptions. Yes, it would have been better of Honolulu had built any system in the 70s or 80s than to have waited 25 years. But now there is only one shot and the public should have a chance to hear all sides. I agree with your earlier post that it boils down to nabbing all those free Federal dollars before they vanish. Ian, you summarized it very neatly. The “review of available options” was in essence a simulacrum of an actual review, a facsimile of a real review designed to manage perceptions. Yes, it would have been better of Honolulu had built any system in the 70s or 80s than to have waited 25 years. But now there is only one shot and the public should have a chance to hear all sides. I agree with your earlier post that it boils down to nabbing all those free Federal dollars before they vanish.

]]> By: stevelaudig http://ilind.net/2010/03/05/the-basic-problem-of-todays-rail-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-15920 stevelaudig Sat, 06 Mar 2010 11:26:53 +0000 http://ilind.net/?p=4422#comment-15920 Four years ago a city [of 6 million] in China decided it needed a subway and began studying the situation. Last year the city broke ground. In four years it expects to be finished. Is it really a democracy when implementation of policy is delayed by a quarter of a century [as in Honolulu] by lawyers, lobbyists, intellectually and morally corrupt officeholders and elections? Four years ago a city [of 6 million] in China decided it needed a subway and began studying the situation. Last year the city broke ground. In four years it expects to be finished. Is it really a democracy when implementation of policy is delayed by a quarter of a century [as in Honolulu] by lawyers, lobbyists, intellectually and morally corrupt officeholders and elections?

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